Azuka friends and family —

Erlina Ortiz

Happy Spring! We hope you are well and staying safe. At Azuka, even without productions this season, we are proud and excited to be continuing to hold space for our playwrights’ group New Pages, especially with the group’s new fearless leader Quinn Eli at the helm! To help you get to know Quinn and all of the New Pages members better, Playwrights on Playwrights features all six of them, as interviewed by people who can really dig into their artistic processes — each other! In case you missed them, read the first two interviews here: Val Dunn and Quinn Eli, and Alexandra Espinoza and Bruce Walsh.

Our final part features Douglas Williams and Erlina Ortiz. Doug’s plays have been produced and developed locally at PlayPenn, Azuka Theatre, Orbiter 3, Theatre Horizon, The Foundry & The Painted Bride, and beyond at Great Plains Theatre Conference and SPACE on Ryder Farm. He is the resident playwright here at Azuka, where you may have seen last year’s Ship or the critically acclaimed Shitheads. Erlina, a Dominican-American playwright, performer, and theatre maker is proud to be resident playwright at Power Street Theatre in Philadelphia, where you may have seen her play Las Mujeres in 2018, which won a Bonaly Award for Creation of Community Joy, or Morir Sonyando in 2019, which was Barrymore recommended. Erlina believes being an artist is a superpower, she believes in using her powers for good.

Doug and Erlina spoke over Zoom back in December to talk their playwriting origins, the Philly theater scene, movies and musicals, alien life, and the storytelling power of The Sims. Watch their interview here, and see below for a full transcript.

TRANSCRIPT

ERLINA: Hey Doug!

DOUG: Hello, hi! Yeah I guess we'll say we're both members of Azuka's playwright group, New Pages, and yeah, I guess we're gonna do a Zoom interview [laughs].

ERLINA: And we haven't practiced any of this, and I came up with some of these questions and I don't even know the answers to some of these myself, so.

DOUG: I know, I just looked them up and I was like, oh, God, what the hell am I going to say for that? I'm glad I got them ahead of time.

ERLINA: Yeah, the first one is really, really easy. It's why did you want to be a playwright?

DOUG: Yeah, that's a good place to start I feel like. For me, it was like, so I always grew up telling stories. I was always...my mom went to college for costume design. And so me and my little sister were always in plays and I was always making movies and stuff as I got older. And so I don't know, it was really I guess when I was in, I went to film school, I went to Temple to go to film school. And while I was there, I took an American playwrights class with Ed Soble, who's at Villanova now. And I was kind of at this point where I was like a little frustrated by the film program. And I took this theater class and I was like, oh my God. This is it. Like everything that I was kind of annoyed with with the film department, it felt like the theater totally like filled that void. And I just kind of switched, which was, I don't know...it's so hard to tell a story on the stage. And I think I enjoyed the challenge. And so I kind of switched. I was in theater as a kid, but I didn't really think of myself -- I didn't think to even think about writing a play until I was in college, really. And as soon as I switched, it was great.

ERLINA: So what was it about theater that you felt you were getting something that you weren't getting from the film world?

DOUG: Yeah, well, Temple's got a great program. I wouldn’t say anything bad about...I think the thing that I was a little frustrated about at the time with the program is that the film school is very technical. Filmmaking is hard. And I think a lot of students enter the program and they don't know if they want to be an editor or director or whatever. And so much of the program is about this kind of technical savvy of how to make films and stuff, which is obviously super important. But I was really interested more in the storytelling. There was like Screenwriting I and Screenwriting II, like two writing classes over the course of four years. And it just wasn't...I'm not the most tech savvy dude. Like I could edit my films and stuff. I wasn't great at it. And it was really, I was missing the storytelling aspect of it. And so I think studying theater and playwriting, it's all about the words, it's all about the storytelling. And I love dialogue, too. Even when I was making films, I love writing dialogue. And obviously that's one of your big tools you need in terms of making theater. So, yeah, I think that's why I decided to switch.

ERLINA: That's funny because I remember I did some-- you know how the film department would sometimes cast folks from the theater department at Temple. When were you at Temple?

DOUG: I graduated in 2010. So, I'm old, I know.

ERLINA: Okay, we overlapped a little bit though. I was there when you were there. So I remember getting cast in like this little movie that somebody was making and it was like, I was waiting for them to give me directions, to tell me what they think this character wants, or anything like that. And it was so strange, because they were literally like, Here's your script, go. And I was just like, what? I just read these words now? Like, I can put my own character into this but I don't know anything about this character. And the guy who was doing the movie, it was just totally like, he wasn't worried about that. He was worried about angles and how it looks and things like that. And I was like, Woah, this is weird. So, yeah, film and theater. I think maybe that's actually something that film needs to learn from theater in a way, that that interaction is good for growing film. And probably why a lot of playwrights are writing for TV right now too.

DOUG: Yeah. Yeah, heard. So what about you? I think we should...we can alternate questions, but I feel like you gotta answer the first one, why you wanted to be a playwright.

ERLINA: Yeah. Let me see. I mean, I guess very similar to you, I always was a writer. I always was a performer, always was involved in theater since I did every school show from seventh grade to senior year. And usually a musical, and we only did one a year. So it's not like it was that much. But I was in the chorus, and I was always an artsy kid, and English was my favorite subject. And I started writing little books and stories and poems and just all those things. Since I was a kid, writing was just always an outlet for me. I was such a nerd, I would literally come home from school at like twelve, thirteen years old and sit in front of our computer and like, work on my novel.

DOUG: That's amazing, oh my God.

ERLINA: Because, that was my escape, you know, it was a safe place for me. But I was also very much a performer, so I very much wanted to be on stage, be in the limelight, the spotlight type of personality was much more...I'm less like that now. But as a teenager, I always wanted to be the one who was getting the attention, probably because I was a middle child — am the middle child. So, yeah, I think at Temple, I took a playwriting class and was like, OK, yeah, this is bringing these two things that I love together that I didn't realize. Like, I thought all playwrights were old dead white men, you know? Like I really didn't think of playwrights as someone modern, so I didn't really feel like it was an option at all? So when I started actually learning about more contemporary playwrights and things like that, I was like, oh, this is actually a thing, maybe I do want to do this. But what really, obviously — Well, maybe not obviously is anyone who doesn't know me — but what really cemented it was when I started working with Power Street, which is my resident company, and I just had to write a play because that's what we do, and I think I've operated well in my life in moments where I just had to do something and channel all the skills that I've had over the years to make something happen. So after that, I really felt a sense of power as a playwright and like, OK, like, OK, acting is great, I love being on stage...but someone else is giving you those words, you know, like someone else is creating this character or someone else is deciding what stories are important to be told. So when I realized that someone else could be me, I could be the one figuring out what's important and I could be the one exploring these characters and having this power to create roles for other actors? That felt really different. I felt like an extra level of like, OK, yeah. And also playwriting is something that you don't need permission to do from anybody; to act, you need someone to cast you, to direct you, someone to hire you. Well I guess you could just get friends together and do a show, but like I could just be writing at any time.

DOUG: Right, you don't need money to do it, you just sit down at your computer.

ERLINA: You need a basic working computer. But yeah, or I guess you can write —

DOUG: Longhand. Right.

ERLINA: I can't read my handwriting, so. Yeah. So I think I realized, Oh, this is something that I can do, it just kind of manifested and built from there. I didn't really call myself a playwright until I got into The Foundry, and then I was like, Oh, these people are calling me playwrights. I guess I really am a playwright. So I needed that validation from other playwrights. Playwrights that I like was like, Wow, y'all are really good playwrights.

DOUG: That's awesome. Can you talk about Power Street a little just for those who maybe don't know about Power Street?

ERLINA: Yeah yeah, sure. So Power Street Theater was founded by Gabriela Sanchez. We were both undergrads at Temple together. Multicultural theater company. We were founded very much based off of things that are being discussed right now in American theater, a feeling of, where do we belong in this landscape? Gabi came up to me and was like, I'm starting this theater company if you want to join? And it was very much naive young people having a big dream and not maybe fully understanding everything that went into actually making that dream happen. But here we are eight years later, and we've done awesome shows, often my shows because I'm the resident playwright. But we devised a lot of shows, we have classes, we have community events. I mean, everything is a little wonky right now with COVID, but we're having a bingo night tonight on Zoom.

DOUG: Nice! Oh, that's great.

ERLINA: Our first one! So, Power Street is very much about the community in North Philadelphia. It was very, very underserved in terms of the arts community, and other ways as well. And I'm Dominican and Gabi’s Puerto Rican and North Philadelphia is very, that's the community out there. So the first time I worked in North Philly, I was teaching for the Norris Square Neighborhood Project and acting class. And I remember walking down the street and being like, Oh my God, like this reminds me so much of my hometown! There’s bachata playing out the windows, and I can smell the Dominican food! So I felt very much a sense of this is like a home and then so that feeling and Gabi having that same connection to the community, and both of us loving the community, loving the arts, having this Temple education that taught us all these different things, we were able to make it happen. And I really don't know what I would be doing right now if Power Street wasn't existing. I'm serious, because freelance artists right now are struggling so hard and like, I am a freelance artist in a lot of ways. But I also sort of have this backbone of Power Street that is a foundation that's holding me up through all of this. And a lot of people don't have that. And then big organizations with like buildings to maintain and like twenty-five staff are struggling right now. So we're kind of in that happy medium of surviving this and being able to maybe come out on the other side and still be intact as a collective and as human beings that need mental and physical support in life. So yeah, my long-winded answer.

DOUG: No, no that's great! I mean eight years. Wow. That's like, what an achievement. That's insane. I can't imagine.

ERLINA: Yeah. Yeah. We're going on nine now. We're closer to nine years. I mean it's all I've done, I can't believe it. My birthday's actually today which is weird.

DOUG: Oh my God. Happy birthday! What? I didn't know that. [laughing] We coulda done this a different day!

ERLINA: [laughing] I know! I didn't even think about it because we actually scheduled this last week and then we just rescheduled it and I just didn't think of it, and then I was like Oh, that's right.

DOUG: Yeah, oh my God. Happy birthday. That's crazy.

ERLINA: Thank you. So, I don't know why — oh, just we're having a lot of transition feeling right now in the air. It's like the end of the year and the holidays and like, what's 2021 gonna bring. So. Yeah.

DOUG: All right, question two. Should I ask this one?

ERLINA: Oh my God, question two, are we only on question two?

DOUG: [laughing] I guess, we can go rapid fire.

ERLINA: What other artistry do you engage with that isn't playwriting?

DOUG: Well, I said I went to film school and so I still kind of dabble. I got some screenplays kicking around and like TV pilots and stuff. It's actually kind of more recent that I've been trying to work in a new medium. For the last 10 years, I've really just been writing plays, like a short story here and there. But yeah, just kind of recently been getting into the film and television stuff again, or trying to, which has been fun, and actually more difficult than I would have thought. Like I think I've said this in New Pages meetings recently, but I was so sure that like my ten thousand hours of work as a playwright was going to very easily transfer over to working in film and TV. And as soon as they started, it was like, OK, that's actually not...it's not going to be like that. Pretty different. So yeah, trudging along, trying to figure it out as I go.

ERLINA: Yeah. What is the hardest part you feel like between now switching back the other way?

DOUG: Yeah. Yeah. I think it's hard because a screenplay is so visual. I think...at least this is how I think about playwriting — Is that like, and maybe I'm just talking specifically about myself in terms of writing, like the the strongest tool that I have as a playwright I feel like is dialogue and you can build character through dialogue. It's the spoken word that’s the strongest tool, I think, in playwriting? And in a screenplay, it's the visual, it's really...you're trying to craft an image, but on the page. And scenes are like a page and a half long, whereas in theater it's like they can go ten plus. Yeah, you can have a whole...I’m working on a play now that's just one scene. It's completely linear. And so that's been really difficult. It's been a fun challenge though. When I write a play sometimes I try to put as few stage directions in as possible because I love collaborating with directors and it's like, How do you see, you know...like to try to give us little direction, kind of give room for the director to put their stamp on it. And you can't do that when you're writing a screenplay, it has to be so specific, really. You have to see it in your head as you're writing it, you know, maybe even more specific than you do when you're making theater. So I don't know, it's hard, but yeah, it's been fun.

ERLINA: That's so funny because I feel like I'm having a similar...I'm working on a musical right now. So it's a similar situation where I'm like, oh, all these playwright skills that I have are going to easily transfer over to working on a musical. And in some ways they do, like basic ideas about storytelling and character development do transfer over but a play is about dialogue and I'm very much a dialogue-heavy person and I feel like I tell a lot about my characters through their dialogue and a musical is more about like that big emotion exploding into a song? And it's not subtle at all, in a play, no one would ever say "All I want in my life is to be accepted." You know, but in a musical literally they're singing those words. They're singing exactly what they're thinking, exactly what they want. And it was hard for me. Now I'm getting more and more into it, especially because now I'm getting a chance to actually see when I write these lyrics, how do they then turn into a song and realize which lyrics come out the most powerful. But yeah, like writing, "I just want someone to believe in me." [laughs] I would never write that in a play! But in a musical, it's very much the style. So that has been a big jump for me. I'm just trying to understand this is a different medium. How do I communicate the big idea, what I would normally communicate through subtle ten page to twelve page long dialogue...into a two-page song, basically, and a moment that's high energy. So it's been a good challenge though. I feel like after this I'm going to go back and be a better playwright. Because I'm stretching the muscles so much. And learning to cut in a musical, things get cut and moved with no second thought: Okay, that moment's gone. I don't feel precious as much about it as I do when I'm working on a play. So yeah, that's my other artistry right now.

DOUG: Why do you feel that is, I guess, that they're different in a musical? Is it just because you're working with collaborators or you just have to move so quickly?

ERLINA: Yeah, I wonder. I feel like it's more because a musical is always about getting down to the nugget of the main theme, the main emotion, the main issue, like in a scene with five characters, you can touch on five different themes, you can jump around. It can be someone who doesn't actually say what they're meaning, you can layer things in differently. With a musical I feel like you just have to continue to just pare down. So cutting feels more like getting to what I need to get to. Especially as it becomes clear. Whenever I feel like the scene is too long or a moment is too long and I don't know what needs to be cut or what needs to move, then that just means that I'm not clear about what it is that I'm trying to do with the scene. So as soon as it becomes clear that this is what I'm actually achieving in this scene, it's easy to get rid of the other stuff because it's like, You were great. You're an awesome line. But you're not doing that in the scene. So I think that that is easier to get to in a musical in certain ways because you're forced to just get down to the nugget of, what is the hook of this song? And how does that build out to the whole rest of the moment?

DOUG: Yeah. It'd be so interesting to see what your plays are like after this, you know, if there is some difference, if you're using that tool in your plays.

ERLINA: Right, right! Yeah. I mean none of my plays are like each other at all at this point. All right. Well I guess we should do like a speed round at some point, right? OK, speed round, this is a good one for speed: What is a piece of art that has inspired your work?

DOUG: Yeah, so going back to Ed Sobel's class at Temple, I think the two plays that really made me like, Damn, maybe I want to be a playwright were True West, Sam Shepard. And then Topdog Underdog by Suzan-Lori Parks. I think both of them, because they're...Topdog Underdog's a true two-hander, True West isn't really. There are other characters, I think there's two other characters in that. But I loved, in both of those, the idea of telling an entire story with just these two characters in one place, like coming from film that just kind of knocked me out, the ability to do that. To tell a complete story with these characters, and it's so strong. Both of those plays are so strong and awesome. And so, yeah, this is lightning round. So I'll stop talking [laughs].

ERLINA: OK, my answer is, Maria Irene Fornes. I didn't discover her until recently, like in the last three to four years or something. But I think that when I found out about her and her style and started reading her stuff, it really sort of validated what I had already been doing in certain ways? Because I was like...I don't think my writing is anything like her writing, but there are certain things that she does in the way that she approaches writing that really resonates with the way that I feel about it, that was totally different than what I was taught in undergrad or any other kind of playwriting platform. So I feel like when I learned about her, I felt like I had a lot more permission to just do whatever I wanted to do. Like if she can do that and she can write this crazy-ass play in this way and just break all these rules then, like, why can't I?

DOUG: That's awesome. That's great.

ERLINA: She's awesome. She's an amazing writer, and person, and teacher.

DOUG: How does your family and your hometown influence your work?

ERLINA: Too much. Especially my family, my hometown not as much. I feel like I have yet to really dive into my hometown. I mean North Philly and my hometown are very similar. So I think that there is some crossover there. But my mom is very, very...I think mother-daughter relationships, even if they're disguised as like strangers who are different generations or sisters or anything like that, like that relationship, because I love my mother so much, but we're also so different. So I'm always being challenged to love someone who I don't always agree with. And that is very much a theme in my work. So, yeah, I think my mom especially has influenced my work a lot.

DOUG: That's great. That's perfect. Same with me. I mean, I feel like my family for sure influences every piece that I write. I just did a play with Azuka called SHIP. And that took place in my hometown and was very much about sibling relationships, when you get older and about struggling to communicate with your parents, and so that play for sure. But that was the first time that I've ever written about my hometown, I think, outside of like high school when I was running around making movies and stuff. So I'm interested to see if moving forward, if there's another story that takes place in the town I grew up in. And maybe there's not, maybe it was just that one, but I don't know. Yeah. So I guess we'll see.

ERLINA: My hometown has a lot of history and interesting stories there. So there's always a part of me...but Lynn Nottage beat me to it because Sweat is based in my hometown.

DOUG: Oh no way! Oh wow. Well, there's room for more than one play.

ERLINA: Yeah, Reading, PA, that's where I grew up. So I remember being like, Dang, she beat me to it! [laughing] She's not even from there and she wrote the Reading story! But that was also a very specific time period story. So, Reading has a lot of other stories in it right now. Okay, how has Philadelphia affected your work as an artist?

DOUG: Philly has affected it, like only in the positive. I don't know, Philly is an amazing town to make theater in. So after I graduated from Temple, I spent the summer afterwards at the O'Neill in Connecticut and then got an internship at Manhattan Theater Club in New York City. And so, like, very quickly after graduating from Temple with a film degree, I was in Manhattan working at Manhattan Theater Club in the literary department as an intern, and it was awesome and crazy. And I was in New York for two years and then it was really hard. You know, you get laid off from jobs and everything's so expensive there. And it was like, damn, I was kind of stuck, wasn't sure exactly what to do. And I was like, maybe I'll just move back to Philly, just because it was the only other city that I knew. It was like, well, New York's OK. But I'm like, there's no way I'm going to be able to...this isn't sustainable at all. Maybe I'll move back to Philly and we'll just see if that works. And if that doesn't work out, maybe I'll try something else, because I was just working in bike shops at the time after my internship, you know, I was like I was working just crappy retail jobs. And it was the best; moving to Philly changed everything I feel like. Whereas in New York, I couldn't even get people to show up to my readings. I mean, I was writing really shitty plays at the time, but no one could come out. It's like you're working so hard you don't even really have time to see plays. Come to Philadelphia, you just go to a random opening night party and you bump into three artistic directors and they're like, yeah, send me your stuff. That's how I met Kevin. Kevin Glaccum, Artistic Director at Azuka, I just kind of bumped into him and he's like "Send me your play" and then like...I don't know, that was when I was younger and the vibe, it was very much like open and great. When I moved back to Philadelphia, I just felt so welcomed. And I haven't left, you know, I've been here for eight years now. It's great too that you were just talking about Power Street because you can do that in Philly, too. Like in New York, there's a gajillion theater companies and in Philly, there's space and room and there are different audiences. And there are audiences that are excited to see different levels of theater. There's people go see a show at the Wilma, but then they'll also go see some Fringe show in a basement, that same audience. They're very daring. I feel like Philly audiences are very daring and they don't discriminate so much between at least like a certain...

ERLINA: Yeah, being like, “Oh I only go to this level of show" or whatever.

DOUG: Exactly! Right, right, I think. Yeah. Philly audience members are pretty adventurous, so. Yeah. So it's been great. I love Philly.

ERLINA: I think the new play atmosphere in Philly is the main thing that I'm really thankful for because there's been a lot of cultivation of young playwrights I feel. At least in the last...I feel like I came in on the wave of that so I've benefited from it a lot, of just being like, OK, yes, we're going to be supporting young playwrights and we're going to be creating space for playwrights to connect, to share: New Pages and Foundry and things like that. Like that has always been a big part of what I think creates a foundation for playwrights, because if you don't have even someone to share your pages with...How are you going to learn? How are you going to grow? And it's true, if you're so busy all the time, like in New York or just how we get sometimes, you're not even seeing other theater, like...Okay, I think we need to actually do a lightning round. Maybe we'll go to the fun cues?

DOUG: Oh yeah. These are perfect for...

ERLINA: Like, one sentence answers.

DOUG: Okay, good good good. Yeah.

ERLINA: [laughing] I’m glad that we’re on the same page here. Okay, what was something on your wish list as a kid and something on your wish list now? This was an ice breaker I did recently at a Power Street meeting.

DOUG: This is good, yeah that's a good question, especially for the time of year that it is. So I think when I was a kid I was super into LEGOs. So I'll just say LEGOs were almost always on my wish list. And this year I think I want one of those like hammocks that, if you're in Clark Park, or whatever, and you see people with those like fabric hammocks that they set up on trees, you know what I'm talking about? Those like portable hammock things. I think I wanna get one of those. Yeah, that'd be cool because there's so many parks in Philly and it'd be cool to have one of those.

ERLINA: When the spring comes around.

DOUG: Yeah, when, when it gets nice out again of course.

ERLINA: This was my answer actually that I gave the other day, was that when I was a kid I wanted a dollhouse, like a really big one, like I just wanted a big dollhouse. I mean I play the Sims a lot so...

DOUG: Oh nice! I played the Sims too.

ERLINA: I guess I ended up like having my own dollhouse that way. But now that I'm an adult, I want an actual house.

DOUG: [laughing] That's good, that's the perfect answer.

ERLINA: [laughing] That's how it has changed over the years. I would not want a house as big as I wanted my dollhouse to be, like I do not want to have to clean all that.

DOUG: That's so funny, I wonder if — I know we're doing lightning round — but I wonder if...someone should do a study of, like, how many playwrights played The Sims when they were kids? Because it is like theater kind of you know, you're like creating this house and this space...

ERLINA: Yeah, yeah. It's telling stories, and building...yeah, I really feel like I was obsessed with The Sims — and this is slightly a tangent — but I think my organizational skills specifically come from obsessively playing The Sims, because on that game you have to plan. You're going to go to the table, you're going to make dinner, you're going to make sure to get sleep before you have to go to work, before you have to feed the baby. And all these things. And that planning and being able to think like, OK, how can I make the most of this Sim time? I swear I use that to this day in my head. It might be a problem actually. "I'm going to do this then I'm gonna do this then I'm gonna do this." And like, some people don't have those skills! I think they should just go play the Sims and then...

DOUG: [laughing] Yeah. All kids, maybe all children should play the Sims.

ERLINA: They should, they should! I made my little sister play it.

DOUG: [laughing] Yeah, my sister didn't like it so much. So what was something that you believed when you were younger that you now know is wrong? That's a good one.

ERLINA: What was something I believed when I was younger that I now know is wrong...God, I feel like I can't think of a good one right now. Are you thinking of one?

DOUG: I thought of one before. Yeah, before we signed on when I saw the question. When I was a kid, I thought that when I was in the car with my dad and we were listening to the radio, I thought there was a little band, like little people inside the radio that were playing.

ERLINA: Oh my God, so did I! [laughs]

DOUG: Yeah, and you, like, flipped the, you know, you hit the button and then they would just start playing a different song or whatever. [laughing] I was pretty sure.

ERLINA: Oh my God, I should've thought of that one. That's so funny, me too. I really thought...I remember specifically the moment, I was like six years old where it finally clicked. Where I was like, Oh, no, there's not little people in there. Like, wow. Yeah, that's so funny. I think that's probably the main one. And I also used to think when I was a kid that my toys would come to life at night. But I think that's like a damage of being a 90s kid because there was a lot of movies about toys coming to life when I was growing up. So I was just convinced...and now I have two little teddy bears on my bed and every once in a while I just look at them like...

DOUG: Did that move? Did I leave that there? That's a good one. That's good.

ERLINA: How far in the future would you want to see?

DOUG: That's hard. I really don't know. I mean. [laughing] I don't know, it's kind of freaky sometimes, like, I don't know how far dare I look into the future with, like, you know, sometimes stuff can look pretty bleak and it's like, I don't know if I wanna go all that far. I guess it would be interesting to see a hundred years. I guess I'd go like a hundred years. I don't know. Hopefully global warming hasn't totally...fucked everything up by then.

ERLINA: Yeah I guess that's always like the scary part of that question.

DOUG: Yeah, yeah. But if I'm trying to think in a positive way. Yeah, if like...

ERLINA: If we get our shit together, what would...

DOUG: Yeah. Right. Let's pretend like there will still be civilization in a hundred years. Yeah. I guess a hundred years would be cool.

ERLINA: Solid amount of time. Yeah I guess one hundred years ago was like 1920. Like the Roaring 20s or whatever. So yeah maybe in a hundred years we'll have something like that. You know what I think I may want to do like fifty, because that way I could actually like meet my, like, great-grandchildren or something.

DOUG: Ooh, that would be good, that's smart, yeah! And maybe you're still around too, it could be like one of those movies where your younger self meets your older self.

ERLINA: Oh no! Meet my like 85 year-old self. OK, ooh — You have to do, what is something you believe, but you can't prove?

DOUG: [laughing] This one was hard, when you sent the questions, I was like, I don't know about this one. So I was going to say something stupid like that I believe Ben Simmons and Joel Embiid are going to win an NBA championship in Philadelphia, but I can't prove it because it hasn't happened yet. So I don't know, what's yours, this was the one that stumped me kind of.

ERLINA: Oh, I recently watched that Amazon special called Phenomenon about like the aliens visiting us or whatever, the UFOs and all that. And it was really, really good and just interesting and probably full of conspiracies. But who knows, I just liked it, whatever. But my conclusion at the end of it was that I think actually — and I know I can't prove it, but I'm sure I'm right — is that the aliens are actually just underwater beings, that are kind of like...

DOUG: You think they're already here?

ERLINA: ...coming up to to see what, like, the surface people — yeah, I think they're in the water. I think they're deep in the ocean and that like they every once in a while come to check out what the surface beings are doing. Yeah. Because if you look at the evidence, if you look at the evidence, it's just, all signs are pointing to advanced underwater deep ocean citizens.

DOUG: Really! I had no idea. I've never even heard this theory. So they talk about this in the movie I guess?

ERLINA: This is not a theory that they came up with. This is my theory.

DOUG: Oh, oh, oh, okay! All right. That makes it more interesting.

ERLINA: They just presented the evidence of, like, we don't know what this is, this is unidentified, the government is finally letting us know something about this. It's official, we don't know what these UFOs are, but after watching the whole thing and kind of looking up info, my conclusion is that they're underwater creatures. And I think it makes sense? Of course we're gonna be like, "They're from space!" and they're like, "We're right under your feet!"

DOUG: [laughing] That's so funny. I buy it. Okay, that's a good one. That's a really good one actually.

ERLINA: All right. Last one?

DOUG: Sure. Yep. Last one. Let's do it.

ERLINA: When will you know that you have made it?

DOUG: Yeah, this is tough, too, and I was trying to think, I don't know...Would you ever know? I feel like the one thing, and I hope...Whatever, my boss might watch this, but maybe not. But like getting to quit your day job would be pretty dope, like having no day job and being like, I'm just a writer? That would feel like probably the most...I don't know, if that event happened, I'd be like, OK, this is definitely next level, this is cool. I'm just going to be able to write...

ERLINA: "I'm getting paid to write."

DOUG: Yeah. Yeah. So many other things have to fall into place for that to happen, so. For right now I'll say that that feels like that would be the next really cool benchmark.

ERLINA: Yeah. I mean that's one of the things that happened to me for the first time this year, was actually that we got a grant for me to work on something.

DOUG: Wow! Ugh, I'm so jealous.

ERLINA: So obviously not enough to survive off of, but I'm getting a little bit of income right now, that's just for writing!

DOUG: That's awesome. Yeah, that's awesome.

ERLINA: I think I'll know when I've made it when I don't have any debt, when my debt is done and when I can feel like there's some stability. But there isn't, like, not knowing what things are going to look like in six months or a year, when I can look forward...I don't want to look forward too much because you can only plan so much. But I feel like if I can look forward three years in my life and feel financially stable and good artistically about what I'm doing and good about everything that Power Street is doing, that I'm going to be like, alright, this is making it. I don't need more than this. If that all happens, then I'll be fine. I just need to not be worried about debt or something. [crossing fingers] Come on! Student loan forgiveness!

DOUG: It's possible! I bet...I bet if you go three years into the future, I bet that's where Erlina is.

ERLINA: No student loan debt anymore; oh my God, please. All right. I guess that's good, we did way more than we...

DOUG: We did, I know! Yeah, we were gonna do twenty minutes and it's like forty-five or something. This was awesome! This was so fun though.

ERLINA: This was fun though! I feel like I've learned all these things about you.

DOUG: I know! Well it's so funny, yeah because we're usually talking to...We're always in, like — I guess this counts as a theater setting — but we're always in a group together or we're going over pages and we see each other at a show or something. And so it's nice just to, just to chill and chat. So this is fun.